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timepiececlockThe Conqueror of Shambala
- Hey, those are Greed's chimera lackies, aren't they? HUZZAH! Alter!characters this soon!
- I'm not surprised that Hohenheim made the prosthetics. I bet Ed knows enough to repair them, not build them.
- "He disappeared one day." Shit, Hohenheim is just a fuck up of a father all around, isn't he? He doesn't even stick around with his son in this world. Poor Ed.
- I think Noa is Rose's alter, but I'm not sure. She sort of looks like her, sort of doesn't.
- I love how bitter Edward is. Even though he doesn't regret the trade, he's not happy here and he's resigned himself to that.
- I love how old he looks. Is he 18, 19? Anyway, he looks older and that's hot. Also a little strange, because they're really making him look like Hohenheim. The longer face, in particular.
- Gracia!
- HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGHES!
- HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGHES!
- Hughes being racist. NOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!! NEVER! MAKE IT STOP! STUPID 1920s JUDGEMENTAL IDEOLOGY!
- "How about if you go and confess to Gracia-san already and stop worrying about others." BWHAHAHA EDWARD I LOVE YOU. You already know they can be happy.
- WAS THAT PRIDE IN THE CAR WHAT THE FUCK?! OMG PRIDE!
- I figured that it would be the human version, but I was hoping he was evil. He doesn't look evil. Hm... Jewish, huh? Interesting. I wonder if Scar will be Jewish or gypsy.
- Did...Envy just eat his own father?
- Were they keeping Hohenheim trapped there, to torture information about alchemy from him? Some nice buddies. That's what you get for joing a secret cult.
- Roy's a police officer now? That's... odd symmetry, given Alter!Hughes is also a policeman.
- This is sad. Such a difference from the triumphant Roy we saw at the end of the series. Also, I badly want to know why he and Hawkeye broke up. Is the implication that he's waiting for Ed? That seems odd, given how they parted at the end of the series. So I don't think it's Ed. Hughes, maybe.
- Alphonse is having Alter!Alphonse's dreams? This whole human transmutation business is fucked up indeed.
- Izumi. ::heart breaks:: You were strong and beautiful, and all your children do you proud.
- And the first shot of Alphonse is in the desert outside Lior, in a red coat, and out of water. FMA MOVIE I LOVE YOU.
- Armstrong. You are truly a force unto yourself. You should be friggin' head of parliament.
- This invasion army is interesting. I want to know how they have figured out how to permanently harness the gate without drastic loss, and on a major scale. Maybe it's a one-way ticket, and only works from the other side. I guess they used the homunculus to anchor the gate open, as the homunculus were gatedemons in the first place.
- AL IS SO BADASS. I KNEW HE WOULD BE.
- SCIEZSKA'S IN PARLIAMENT. THAT'S AWESOME. GO LITTLE BOOKWORM, GO!
- His soul is easily detachable? He's way too calm about that. Hmmm.... I'm going to guess this process is a little like how Naruto controlls his clones. If it were dangerous to him, he wouldn't do it so easily.
- NO NO NO ALPHONSE YOU CAN'T BE HITLER YOUTH NO NO NO NO NO!
- "Its holy power that will save Germany!" I love that expression on Ed's face. That "Smile through my teeth at the crazy religious fanatics that are all the same no matter what world I go to."
- They "received the information from a party member"? Is that Thule society member, or Nazi party member? What year is it again? 1923? I swear if they made Hughes a Nazi I'll fucking scream. They can't make Hughes a Nazi. Hughes is the opposite of all Nazidom. Hughes is a teddy bear. Teddy bear hearts can't be Nazis.
- Fuhrer? Is that the arbitrary name for the current German leader, or do they mean Hitler? But Hitler wasn't Fuhrer for a few more years.
- Wow... Al's currently in BOTH worlds? Poor kid's soul is fucked up.
- "My technique to transfer souls doesn't last very long..." Wait. Stop. Rewind. Did they just say "jutsu"?
- Heh. Alter!Alphonse thinks Edward is suffering from psychotic hallucinations.
- Hughes. No. No. Those fuckers nooooooooooo. HUGHES! NO! Don't let this happen! You can be more! YOU CAN BE MORE!
- I am so lost on the historical timeline of all of this. I need an FMA movie primeror something to explain it.
- Wait, Noa is okay? What happened? That was her that got taken, right?
- OH MY GOD. Alter!ALPHONSE HAS TUBERCULOSIS?! I didn't see that coming. Wow. ...I find Alter!Alphonse compelling, as compared to Alphonse Elric. Alter!Al wasn't raised with an older brother, and must resent the way Ed suddenly thinks of him as younger. Alter!Al has had the science all his life, without Ed's shadow. He's proud of his work, and more than that feels his own mortality. He wants to leave a mark on the world through science. He's also very nationalistic, as so many young Germans were at that time.
- "This country will be reborn." Hughes. No. Hughes. My heart is breaking. No. Please no. God damn you FMA-- you can't do this to Hughes twice. Please. First you kill him, then you make him a Nazi? Why?! And Hughes... why oh why couldn't you just choose Gracia? Choose your family over your country, for once in your fucking life.
-WHAT?! WHAT WAS THAT SKIP!?! THE VIDEO SKIPPED! NO! I WANTED TO SEE THE REST OF THAT SCENE IT CAN'T SKIP!
- Gluttony. Well, I guess we know who won that fight. I'm not surprised-- I had thought Dante got eaten.
- When Wrath is drowning, for the first time he looks like Izumi.
- "Why did you lend a hand to these people?!" Oh Ed. You've got to stop thinking he'll ever live up to your expectations.
- Okay. Maybe this is his one attempt at redemption. Shitty way to do it though-- letting all these people get killed in political machinations so Edward can go home.
- ALPHONSE! NO!
- He left her. It's probably for the best, and I don't think they were in love (she just wanted to escape and his dream was her dream, and he was just lonely and prone to bonding with people like Noa. Actually, thinking back, Ed's gotten along better with people like the Ishbalans and the gypsies and the Lior citizens than he did with his own home town or central.)
- The blond woman. THe conqueror Is she... Dante? I think she has to be. Not Dante of Amestris, but Alter!Dante.
- ROY, I LOVE YOU. THAT'S RIGHT, GET OFF YOUR ASS AND STOP FEELING SORRY FOR YOURSELF. THAT'S MY GUY.
- "But this battle is our fault." Actually, that's completely true. In fact, Amestris might have been better of if the Elric bloodline had never existed. Hohenheim started it, Ed continued it, and Alphonse finished it. Between the three of them and Hohenheim's first wife, they've managed to destroy multiple cities, cause the deaths of thousands of people, break the laws of nature and all that is sane, bring human-devouring monsters to life, cause multiple wars or battles, infect the Alterverse with their alchemic science and infect their own world with Alterverse science. Neither world is better for it.
- It's cool to see Roy fight. We never really got Roy in an out-and-out battle in the tv series. If he dies I'll kill a kitten. YOU HEAR ME FMA?! IF ROY DIES I'LL KILL A KITTEN. A BABY KITTEN'S BLOOD WILL BE ON YOUR HANDS.
---
okay skipping all the parts that I could stop watching to type about.... SCAR! ::laugh:: And he's glaring at them for no good reason! ::laugh:: AND LUST! SHE'S THERE TOO! I KNEW IT!
It seems so right to me that Ed and Al go off into the sunset with the gypsies. You know what I said just above about Edward bonding with refugees and nomads and disadvantaged souls and exotic people more than he ever bonded with his own people? Case in point. And of course he might not stay with them forever, but this is a good ending. As it's alluded to in the series and outright stated in the film-- Ed is and always will be a homeless wanderer. He will always be a gypsy. And Alphonse will always be as well, because he done with being left behind. Left behind by Father, then Mother, and then Edward. Everyone he loves leaves him. And Alphonse isn't going to let it happen again.
FUCK, THIS IS GOOD.
There are bits of it that felt underdevelopped, especially Amestris-side, but for the character arcs of Edward and Alphonse? Perfect. FUCKING PERFECT. My boys... my boys. Emotional pay-off has been achieved. THANK YOU FMA.
... Except that I hate the fact that Hughes is probably still a Nazi. WTF.
BUT ANYWAY FORGETTING THAT, I LOVE FULLMETAL ALCHEMIST.
SCAR/LUST 4EVA! (with glaring!)
ED/AL/BROTHERHOOD 4EVA! (he wouldn't let Ni-san leave him behind again!)
Damn, this movie made me a Winry/Ed shipper and a Noa/Ed shipper. Can I be both? I am both.
CONCLUDING THOUGHT: Ed is fucking hot in this movie. And since his character isn't 15 anymore, I don't feel at all guilty about saying it. Ed is fucking hot in this movie.
WARNING: Comments below now contain obscenely long paragraphs about various opinions and reactions and discussion about the movie. Because I need to TALK. Talk about it. Now. Talk to me.
- Hey, those are Greed's chimera lackies, aren't they? HUZZAH! Alter!characters this soon!
- I'm not surprised that Hohenheim made the prosthetics. I bet Ed knows enough to repair them, not build them.
- "He disappeared one day." Shit, Hohenheim is just a fuck up of a father all around, isn't he? He doesn't even stick around with his son in this world. Poor Ed.
- I think Noa is Rose's alter, but I'm not sure. She sort of looks like her, sort of doesn't.
- I love how bitter Edward is. Even though he doesn't regret the trade, he's not happy here and he's resigned himself to that.
- I love how old he looks. Is he 18, 19? Anyway, he looks older and that's hot. Also a little strange, because they're really making him look like Hohenheim. The longer face, in particular.
- Gracia!
- HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGHES!
- HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGHES!
- Hughes being racist. NOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!! NEVER! MAKE IT STOP! STUPID 1920s JUDGEMENTAL IDEOLOGY!
- "How about if you go and confess to Gracia-san already and stop worrying about others." BWHAHAHA EDWARD I LOVE YOU. You already know they can be happy.
- WAS THAT PRIDE IN THE CAR WHAT THE FUCK?! OMG PRIDE!
- I figured that it would be the human version, but I was hoping he was evil. He doesn't look evil. Hm... Jewish, huh? Interesting. I wonder if Scar will be Jewish or gypsy.
- Did...Envy just eat his own father?
- Were they keeping Hohenheim trapped there, to torture information about alchemy from him? Some nice buddies. That's what you get for joing a secret cult.
- Roy's a police officer now? That's... odd symmetry, given Alter!Hughes is also a policeman.
- This is sad. Such a difference from the triumphant Roy we saw at the end of the series. Also, I badly want to know why he and Hawkeye broke up. Is the implication that he's waiting for Ed? That seems odd, given how they parted at the end of the series. So I don't think it's Ed. Hughes, maybe.
- Alphonse is having Alter!Alphonse's dreams? This whole human transmutation business is fucked up indeed.
- Izumi. ::heart breaks:: You were strong and beautiful, and all your children do you proud.
- And the first shot of Alphonse is in the desert outside Lior, in a red coat, and out of water. FMA MOVIE I LOVE YOU.
- Armstrong. You are truly a force unto yourself. You should be friggin' head of parliament.
- This invasion army is interesting. I want to know how they have figured out how to permanently harness the gate without drastic loss, and on a major scale. Maybe it's a one-way ticket, and only works from the other side. I guess they used the homunculus to anchor the gate open, as the homunculus were gatedemons in the first place.
- AL IS SO BADASS. I KNEW HE WOULD BE.
- SCIEZSKA'S IN PARLIAMENT. THAT'S AWESOME. GO LITTLE BOOKWORM, GO!
- His soul is easily detachable? He's way too calm about that. Hmmm.... I'm going to guess this process is a little like how Naruto controlls his clones. If it were dangerous to him, he wouldn't do it so easily.
- NO NO NO ALPHONSE YOU CAN'T BE HITLER YOUTH NO NO NO NO NO!
- "Its holy power that will save Germany!" I love that expression on Ed's face. That "Smile through my teeth at the crazy religious fanatics that are all the same no matter what world I go to."
- They "received the information from a party member"? Is that Thule society member, or Nazi party member? What year is it again? 1923? I swear if they made Hughes a Nazi I'll fucking scream. They can't make Hughes a Nazi. Hughes is the opposite of all Nazidom. Hughes is a teddy bear. Teddy bear hearts can't be Nazis.
- Fuhrer? Is that the arbitrary name for the current German leader, or do they mean Hitler? But Hitler wasn't Fuhrer for a few more years.
- Wow... Al's currently in BOTH worlds? Poor kid's soul is fucked up.
- "My technique to transfer souls doesn't last very long..." Wait. Stop. Rewind. Did they just say "jutsu"?
- Heh. Alter!Alphonse thinks Edward is suffering from psychotic hallucinations.
- Hughes. No. No. Those fuckers nooooooooooo. HUGHES! NO! Don't let this happen! You can be more! YOU CAN BE MORE!
- I am so lost on the historical timeline of all of this. I need an FMA movie primeror something to explain it.
- Wait, Noa is okay? What happened? That was her that got taken, right?
- OH MY GOD. Alter!ALPHONSE HAS TUBERCULOSIS?! I didn't see that coming. Wow. ...I find Alter!Alphonse compelling, as compared to Alphonse Elric. Alter!Al wasn't raised with an older brother, and must resent the way Ed suddenly thinks of him as younger. Alter!Al has had the science all his life, without Ed's shadow. He's proud of his work, and more than that feels his own mortality. He wants to leave a mark on the world through science. He's also very nationalistic, as so many young Germans were at that time.
- "This country will be reborn." Hughes. No. Hughes. My heart is breaking. No. Please no. God damn you FMA-- you can't do this to Hughes twice. Please. First you kill him, then you make him a Nazi? Why?! And Hughes... why oh why couldn't you just choose Gracia? Choose your family over your country, for once in your fucking life.
-WHAT?! WHAT WAS THAT SKIP!?! THE VIDEO SKIPPED! NO! I WANTED TO SEE THE REST OF THAT SCENE IT CAN'T SKIP!
- Gluttony. Well, I guess we know who won that fight. I'm not surprised-- I had thought Dante got eaten.
- When Wrath is drowning, for the first time he looks like Izumi.
- "Why did you lend a hand to these people?!" Oh Ed. You've got to stop thinking he'll ever live up to your expectations.
- Okay. Maybe this is his one attempt at redemption. Shitty way to do it though-- letting all these people get killed in political machinations so Edward can go home.
- ALPHONSE! NO!
- He left her. It's probably for the best, and I don't think they were in love (she just wanted to escape and his dream was her dream, and he was just lonely and prone to bonding with people like Noa. Actually, thinking back, Ed's gotten along better with people like the Ishbalans and the gypsies and the Lior citizens than he did with his own home town or central.)
- The blond woman. THe conqueror Is she... Dante? I think she has to be. Not Dante of Amestris, but Alter!Dante.
- ROY, I LOVE YOU. THAT'S RIGHT, GET OFF YOUR ASS AND STOP FEELING SORRY FOR YOURSELF. THAT'S MY GUY.
- "But this battle is our fault." Actually, that's completely true. In fact, Amestris might have been better of if the Elric bloodline had never existed. Hohenheim started it, Ed continued it, and Alphonse finished it. Between the three of them and Hohenheim's first wife, they've managed to destroy multiple cities, cause the deaths of thousands of people, break the laws of nature and all that is sane, bring human-devouring monsters to life, cause multiple wars or battles, infect the Alterverse with their alchemic science and infect their own world with Alterverse science. Neither world is better for it.
- It's cool to see Roy fight. We never really got Roy in an out-and-out battle in the tv series. If he dies I'll kill a kitten. YOU HEAR ME FMA?! IF ROY DIES I'LL KILL A KITTEN. A BABY KITTEN'S BLOOD WILL BE ON YOUR HANDS.
---
okay skipping all the parts that I could stop watching to type about.... SCAR! ::laugh:: And he's glaring at them for no good reason! ::laugh:: AND LUST! SHE'S THERE TOO! I KNEW IT!
It seems so right to me that Ed and Al go off into the sunset with the gypsies. You know what I said just above about Edward bonding with refugees and nomads and disadvantaged souls and exotic people more than he ever bonded with his own people? Case in point. And of course he might not stay with them forever, but this is a good ending. As it's alluded to in the series and outright stated in the film-- Ed is and always will be a homeless wanderer. He will always be a gypsy. And Alphonse will always be as well, because he done with being left behind. Left behind by Father, then Mother, and then Edward. Everyone he loves leaves him. And Alphonse isn't going to let it happen again.
FUCK, THIS IS GOOD.
There are bits of it that felt underdevelopped, especially Amestris-side, but for the character arcs of Edward and Alphonse? Perfect. FUCKING PERFECT. My boys... my boys. Emotional pay-off has been achieved. THANK YOU FMA.
... Except that I hate the fact that Hughes is probably still a Nazi. WTF.
BUT ANYWAY FORGETTING THAT, I LOVE FULLMETAL ALCHEMIST.
SCAR/LUST 4EVA! (with glaring!)
ED/AL/BROTHERHOOD 4EVA! (he wouldn't let Ni-san leave him behind again!)
Damn, this movie made me a Winry/Ed shipper and a Noa/Ed shipper. Can I be both? I am both.
CONCLUDING THOUGHT: Ed is fucking hot in this movie. And since his character isn't 15 anymore, I don't feel at all guilty about saying it. Ed is fucking hot in this movie.
WARNING: Comments below now contain obscenely long paragraphs about various opinions and reactions and discussion about the movie. Because I need to TALK. Talk about it. Now. Talk to me.
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I love Ed and Al so much.
Date: 2005-10-19 10:27 pm (UTC)This was the perfect movie for me.
Have to go to dinner now.
Re: I love Ed and Al so much.
Date: 2005-10-19 10:37 pm (UTC)I have to go to lunch now. 3 hours late.
They are the fucking interdimensional epic romance. Them and Hughes/Gracia. The verse needs balance-- you hurt my lovebirds in one world, give them a fantastic epic romance in another.
How does one get this film....
Date: 2005-10-20 12:05 am (UTC)Redrose
Re: How does one get this film....
Date: 2005-10-20 03:26 am (UTC)You can get it through this torrent. (to save time I just uploaded it to YSI since I can't remember the page I got it from -- simply download it and then open it and it'll work.)
It took me several days.
Re: How does one get this film....
Date: 2006-02-27 09:05 am (UTC)Nazi!Hughes. And other stuff.
Date: 2005-10-20 12:10 am (UTC)Also, I like to think that Roy and Hawkeye didn't break up so much as Roy just needed to be alone for awhile. But hey, now he's back, and so he and Hawkeye can get back together. The movie has not ruined my baby-infested post-series Roy/Hawkeye arc, hooray! Though the greatness that is Games Without Frontiers may have. (Have you read that fic? If not, do, and if you have and hated it, I won't mention it again.)
In related news, Ed is hot. I'd hit that. Age Al up a bit, and I'd hit that too. Did I mention that everybody got hot? Winry was hot and looked so grown-up. And Ed was totally WRONG about Roy's eyepatch not suiting him. I could go on for awhile, but this comment has gotten long enough, so The End.
Re: Nazi!Hughes. And other stuff. part 1
Date: 2005-10-20 04:00 am (UTC)I like to think that Roy and Hawkeye didn't break up so much as Roy just needed to be alone for awhile.
I can believe that. One of the few things that I was unhappy with is that I wasn't sure I understood what they were trying to do with the Roy scenes, so I didn't feel the emotional payoff there as much. I want to know what he is "waiting for", and if it was knowledge of the Elric's fate. If it was that... that doesn't really make sense. He got closure with Edward in episode 49 or whatever. They both went off of their respective missions knowing they'd likely never see each other again, and both had acknowledged mutual respect and admiration, and Edward *finally* got to actually SAY GOODBYE to one of his daddy figures before they left him, and Roy got to see that Edward didn't need daddy figures anymore, and truly had grown up.
Maybe Roy was waiting for himself? Waiting for a reason to be motivated again? To feel like something he does has a positive, rather than negative effect? I'll have to rewatch it again, especially when a better subber comes out. Fork's subs are just okay, not as good as some others. I want to see other ways certain lines might be translated.
Re: Nazi!Hughes. And other stuff. Part 2.
Date: 2005-10-20 04:00 am (UTC)But hey, now he's back, and so he and Hawkeye can get back together.
On the one hand I love that, on the other I don't think Hawkeye is the kind of woman who'd wait two years for a man who's left, even if the reasons he left weren't directed at her. Then again, if he only left 6 months ago... 6 months isn't that long. Either way, I don't think he left right after the movie. If two months have really passed since we last saw the shot of them walking in the market, then I'd guess they had to have been together at least a few months, maybe even a year, depending on how long it took Roy to have a midlife crisis. That's what I'm calling it now-- an early midlife crisis. And you know what, maybe it was one of those things where Hawkeye needed to find her place too, cement something for herself that doesn't resolve around Roy's mission.
Maybe it's like one of those things like I read at the end of this mildly cheesy romance thriller, where the girl tells the guy she needs some time alone to find herself, and he says okay, but to come back and find him when she's ready. And then a year later she shows up at his porch, and he's like "Well. You took your time." And she shrugs, and then they live happily ever after. And you don't know what happened with him in that year-- if he dated or loved anyone, if he had other relationships-- you just know that it doesn't matter, because she's there now and he's there now and they still want each other, after all.
The movie has not ruined my baby-infested post-series Roy/Hawkeye arc, hooray! Though the greatness that is Games Without Frontiers may have. (Have you read that fic? If not, do, and if you have and hated it, I won't mention it again.)
I didn't remember you having a babyfic. Can I read it? Gimme a link, come on now! ...and I *love* Games Without Frontiers. I've been reading the updates. I love it and I love how fast the updates are. Although I thought the idea of Hawkeye being a virgin was pretty stupid, the resulting sex scene was funny and sweet at the same time. And need I mention the fact that there is FAR TOO FEW mature-rated Mustang/Hawkeye fics out there? WHERE'S THE SMUT, DUDE?! I'm a Jossverse ficdom veteran, if there's not oodles of smut out there then there's something wrong with your pairing's fandom! Where's the smut?! ... Then again anime fic just doesn't tend to be as all-around smutty as Buffy/Angel/Firefly fanfiction. Pity.
Right now I want to read an epic, beautiful, heart-wrenching fanfic that's all about Roy and Riza between the tv series and the movie. I want to see them come together as we got hints of, and have lots of sex, and be in love, and have Roy's dissatisfaction with his life and Riza's unwillingness to wait for someone who isn't really "with" her entirely in heart and mind eventually drive them toward a separation. We'll see the rise and fall of their first attempt at a relationship. And then it will end with Riza seeing Roy in the FMA movie, and after he's destroyed the false gate, he'll go talk to her, and they'll stand there and stare into each other's eyes, and he'll ask how she's doing and she'll say she's okay. And she'll ask how he's doing, and he'll say he thinks he's okay now too (totally cribbed that from the end of Fight Club). And he'll ask if she's seeing anyone. And she'll say "not today." And he'll say "Well then. Riza Hawkeye, will you marry me?" And she'll say "No." And he'll say "Riza Hawkeye, will you go out to dinner with me?" And she'll say "Yes."
That's the fic I want.
Re: Nazi!Hughes. And other stuff. Part 2.
Date: 2005-10-20 05:35 am (UTC)I don't think so either. But I wouldn't put it past her to wait that long for Roy. Not that I wouldn't approve of her moving on (see below).
one of those things where Hawkeye needed to find her place too, cement something for herself that doesn't resolve around Roy's mission
I have been shouting this at her through the computer screen for a long time now. "Hawkeye," I tell her, doesn't matter if it's manga or anime because both incarnations need to hear this IMHO, "you are awesome. Don't let some guy be your only reason for living, even if it is Roy."
Re: my fic, I, um, don't have links because I haven't actually posted anything because I haven't actually finished anything. It's just sitting there on my hard drive, all the brainstorming and bits of fic. But as for Games Without Frontiers, I have only one word to describe it and that word is SQUEE. I think it's the multichapteredness and the mixture of G and PG-13 and NC-17 and the dead-on characterization and even though the plot seems to have taken quite a detour from where I originally thought it was heading WHO THE HELL CARES because I have been wishing for some in-series pregnancy fic for MONTHS. It's there in my brainstorming file, almost to the letter, and I knew I couldn't do it justice but KAnderson totally is.
Watching three communities and periodically checking up on two others, as well as occasionally looking at toukakoukan and the FMA sections at ffn and affn, I have seen a total of zero post-movie Roy/Hawkeye fics (though you can never tell with the summaries at ffn) and this is frankly a crime against nature. Why won't people write it? I'll do some myself over the next break if I have to, and yes, that is a threat.
Re: Nazi!Hughes. And other stuff. Part 2.
Date: 2005-10-20 05:45 am (UTC)I'll do some myself over the next break if I have to, and yes, that is a threat.
Don't threaten, do!
It's there in my brainstorming file, almost to the letter, and I knew I couldn't do it justice but KAnderson totally is.
I'm interested in reading yours, so don't be intimidated by another fic! We could do with more out there. Really.
Re: Nazi!Hughes. And other stuff. Part 3 - Hughes.
Date: 2005-10-20 04:23 am (UTC)because we had a pre-formed impression of Hughes (and to a lesser extent, Heiderich), it was also impossible to entirely demonize them, which was a balance I have not seen before and really appreciated.
That's a great way of putting it, and I agree. That's how it felt to me too. And, the further I got into the movie while pondering the Nazi thing, the more I decided that it was really very in-character for Hughes. After all, from his peasant perspective, right now it's not about slaughtering millions of people in camps OR conquering other countries. In the 1920s it's about restoring vitality to their destroyed and demoralized country, giving hope to his fellow countrymen amidst depression and poverty. We look at Nazis in the totality of their campaign, Hughes looking at the Nazi party as it is in 1923, quite different and without the benefit of hindsight. And patriotism? -- TOTALLY in character with Hughes. Revolutionary behavior? Also in-character. I like to think at the end that by witnessing the end of the attempted coup and seeing what came from his leader's attempt to conquer another world, and finally stepping in to save Noa as he should have done from the start, we've seen Hughes reach the end of his nationalist activism. Maybe he'll be disillusioned about the great German destiny now. And that combined with the postive influence of Gracia and the ties of the family he'll create with her... in 15 years when the war starts he'll be a totally different man, a middle-aged man with ties to community and desire for a stable life where his greatest loyalty is to protecting his family, not his country, and he won't have those idealistic nationalistic goggles we see him wearing at the beginning of this movie.
Actually, Heinrich's connection to the Nazi party felt more insidious than Hughes's, to me. Because Heinrich had to know what the science he was doing could be used for, and he was closer to knowing/guessing the motives of the upper-level decision makers.
Re: Nazi!Hughes. And other stuff. Part 3 - Hughes.
Date: 2005-10-20 06:03 am (UTC)I feel that this is exactly the problem with your average WWI/II-era movie/book/whatever. Both the producer of the work and the audience have that hindsight, and each side knows the other has it, so the balance between "Nazis are evil" and "Nazis are people too" has to be so delicately worked. Honestly, this might be my favorite balance so far, though Hughes is kind of an incidental casualty to it. Poor Hughes, always a casualty.
As for his future, it's important to note that for many if not most Germans during WWII, protecting your family and your stable life meant joining the Nazi party and not showing any signs of resistance. However, it hadn't even occurred to me that Gracia probably would be a very positive influence. Oooh, you know what I bet happens? His disillusionment with the party, encouraged by Gracia, causes him to stage a conspiracy to bring it down from the inside. Because of his established ties to the Nazis, he ranks high and is never seriously questioned. The conspiracy? Push Alter!Roy to the top and make him the Fuhrer. Yes.
no subject
Date: 2005-10-20 02:00 am (UTC)Secondly, Naruto's clones? *giggles* I think you meant Naraku. But that's hilarious.
Third, Hughes as a Nazi didn't upset me very much, as he was simply a product of the times. I'm astonished that Gracia was as openminded as she was, but it totally rocked my socks off.
Also, I was able to think of the alter!characters as completely distinct personalities. More or less. Except like Scar/Lust, which was the coolest thing ever even if I was startled away from looking at them by a certain someone screaming two seats down (*mockglares at octopedingenue*). Anyway...the point is, Nazi!Hughes didn't break my heart. Hohenheim did, and Izumi did, and Al did, and Ed did, and Winry did, and Roy did, and Riza did, and...yeah, you get the picture.
part 2
Date: 2005-10-20 04:56 am (UTC)Secondly, no. I meant Naruto's clones. Granted I haven't watched IY in a while, but Naraku's sub-selves like Kagura are independent, thinking, acting, self-determining beings. Naruto's clone jutsu makes a bunch of Narutos, all self-controlling in the reactionary sense, but also all controlled mentally by the original Naruto. It's never explained fully, but I got the impression that he put a little bit of himself into each one, because they all ACT like him (he even argues with himself), but at the same time they all serve the original. And then when one is too badly damaged, it disappears. And presumably if there was any bit of Naruto in the clone, it returns to Naruto. That's what I think Alphonse was doing here-- putting bits of himself into the armor temporarily, controlling them himself yet letting them be partially autonomous too.
While I was watching Alphonse and Wrath interact, I couldn't help but think that maybe Wrath is more like Alphonse than Edward after all. I mean, with the limbs thing and trading mommies thing, Wrath in the series is clearly a parallel to Edward. But seeing him and Alphonse interact on their own... they're really very similar. Wrath is different from all the other Homunculus, because of his time in the gate with a body and his alchemy and his early experiences with Izumi's family environment. Similarly, Alphonse is really different from other people too-- his soul is detachable?! All that time in the gate, all that back and forth and body trading and soul-trading. Metaphysically speaking, Alphonse isn't quite like any other alchemist. Isn't it also intersting how Al still needed circles to do alchemy (presumably because his memory was lost and with it the gate knowledge), but at the same time he's pretty much perfected a practical use of soul-binding alchemy that almost no one else can do, except Tucker and Edward? And presumably Tucker can only do it in Lab 5 because he'd seen Alphonse and knew it could be done. Al, on the other hand... just figured it out. Worked it out how himself.
You know what else I love about this movie? I love that Alphonse is completely out of Ed's shadow. In both worlds. Heinrich never had to grow up with Ed's shadow, and Alphonse has made himself just as badass as Ed was, on his own, with nothing but a dream to go on. And...just like Edward, he uses his power to make mistakes and indirectly cause war and death. Ahhh... my boys. ::huggles them:: You mean well, but the world is probably safer with both of you on the other side and alchemy-less.
Also, I was able to think of the alter!characters as completely distinct personalities.
Yes. Heinrich especially-- I was very pleased with how they managed to give him a lot of complexity in personality without that much actual screentime. For him, and all the characters, they really utilized our pre-set expectations of the characters, and then focused on developing the differences. Because we already knew half the story, they didn't have to work as hard to introduce us to a NEW character, they just had to play with our opinions and assumptions of the old character.
I liked that the writers put in as much overlap as they put in differences-- they feel entirely separate, yet with the potential to be the same.
Except Scar and Lust, of course. They're themselves because they're the crossdimensional epic love story of FMA. Those cats are destined in any world. And Ed and Alphonse are finally where they belong-- off adventuring with them. All the things that Scar and Lust and Ed and Al never got in life Amestris-side, they get Europe-side.
Did you notice that Heinrich would have died the same way as Trisha? I don't think Trisha had TB per se, but the end result would have been the same.
Do you think Noa was Rose's alter, or someone new? I should backcheck on all the VAs. In my mind, Eckhart was Dante's alter. It doesn't make sense because Dante was born hundreds of years ago, but then again Hohenheim took over his alter's body when Dante sent him through the gate, and he was born centuries ago too, and if he has an alter then there's no reason Dante can't have one.
Re: part 2
Date: 2005-10-21 05:48 am (UTC)Part 1
Date: 2005-10-20 04:56 am (UTC)Nazi!Hughes did break my heart, thougn he didn't at all surprise me, it still hurt. But in a weird way because I know I'm watching and projecting all of Nazi history in totality onto him, whereas he's in the party in 1923, which is not the same at all. Anyway, I talked about my thoughts about Hughes in detail a few replies up. :)
Except like Scar/Lust, which was the coolest thing ever even if I was startled away from looking at them by a certain someone screaming two seats down (*mockglares at octopedingenue*).
Ahhh, you got to watch it with someone! I need to make more anime friends down here. Watching it by my lonesome was good because I had no interruptions, but i really wanted someone to squeal to afterward.
no subject
Date: 2005-10-20 04:52 am (UTC)On the evening of the same day, another mass meeting was held at the Circus Krone. For the first time ever, Hitler was introduced as the Fuhrer.* The next day Hitler wrote a letter to one of his acquaintances and for the first time confidently signed it: "der Fuhrer..."
Hughes as a member of the Nazi party? Okay. That makes me not wanna see this now.
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Date: 2005-10-20 05:00 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2005-10-20 05:11 am (UTC)I'm waiting for the DVDRip quality one. Unless someone demands I watch it NOW. ;)
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Date: 2005-10-20 05:18 am (UTC)Hitler didn't take it over until 1921 and immediately started forming it into the great group that we remember them as today. Hitler's version of the Nazi Party seized complete power over Germany in 1933.
Yeah. This is set in 1923, ten years before that, and still fresh from the scarring of WWI.
If you don't mind waiting, then you can wait. You just have greater patience than I. ;D I wanted to watch it, among other things, so I could finally go to the fanfic again without being spoiled. Tried last night, turns out it's pointless endeavor-- most of the people on ff.net haven't even seen the movie either.
no subject
Date: 2005-10-20 05:36 am (UTC)If they'd been treated fairly after the end of the first World War (i.e. the Treaty of Versailles), we might not've had the sequel. Not that I'm saying Hitler should've acted a fool and killed millions of innocent people, but the losers can only suffer so much humilation.
You just have greater patience than I.
I'm already impatient for the Trigun and Bleach movies, and they've just been announced. Don't get me started on how my panties steam at the thought of the Hellsing OVA. All in what it is ... allllll in what it is. I still dig the anime for FMA, but since I've been into the manga, the need to see the post-series flick ebbed. I'll see it, to be certain, just after a decent copy hits the Net.
no subject
Date: 2005-10-20 06:11 pm (UTC)Augh, I need to watch the sub. But I'm waiting for a DVD rip, I satsfied my immeadite need to see the movie with the raw.
Now I have the urge to find my reaction post, which is a lot less coherent than yours. :D
no subject
Date: 2005-10-22 12:44 am (UTC)You know what? On of the things that made Ed so hot in this movie was that he was wearing a real shirt and collar, and a vest. It was a good look for him-- and made him look more like an adult than the black outfit from the series.
Find your reaction post! Tell me your thoughts!
no subject
Date: 2005-10-22 12:52 am (UTC)You didn't see that.>.>
I am an icon-composition whore. XDDD
Mostly incoherent reaction post.
no subject
Date: 2005-10-21 09:35 pm (UTC)Good-looking men, start wearing early-twentieth-century clothing NOWSo, I've put you on my friends list, because we seem to have many friends in common (octopedingenue (http://www.livejournal.com/users/octopedingenue/), flutingfrenzy (http://www.livejournal.com/users/flutingfrenzy/), clodia_risa (http://www.livejournal.com/users/clodia_risa/), zebeckras (http://www.livejournal.com/users/zebeckras/) and riddering (http://www.livejournal.com/users/riddering/)), as well as fandoms.
And your recent entries are amusing and fun.
I'm so bad at these "introduction" posts.